| - mjw (QUIT: Ping timeout: 272 seconds) (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org) | 00:15 | |
| - xandy (QUIT: Ping timeout: 248 seconds) (xandyv@user/xandyv) | 00:19 | |
| - Gooberpatrol_66 (QUIT: Quit: Konversation terminated!) (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 00:32 | |
| minute | vagrantc: that's still ok. it usually throttles there | 01:09 |
|---|---|---|
| josch | hrm... i wonder what happens when one puts it into the desktop reform which provides a much larger heatsink... *thinking emoji* | 01:11 |
| - robin (QUIT: Ping timeout: 260 seconds) (~robin@user/terpri) | 01:12 | |
| - aloo_shu (QUIT: Ping timeout: 252 seconds) (~aloo_shu@84.78.242.52) | 01:24 | |
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| + colinsane (~colinunin@97-113-134-254.tukw.qwest.net) | 03:10 | |
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| + nsc (~nicolas@71-98-142-46.pool.kielnet.net) | 04:02 | |
| + Gooberpatrol66 (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 04:26 | |
| - Gooberpatrol66 (QUIT: Quit: Konversation terminated!) (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 04:36 | |
| + Gooberpatrol66 (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 04:36 | |
| - talos (QUIT: Ping timeout: 265 seconds) (~talos@syn-068-186-150-133.res.spectrum.com) | 04:44 | |
| - robin (QUIT: Ping timeout: 260 seconds) (~robin@user/terpri) | 05:21 | |
| + robin (~robin@user/terpri) | 05:23 | |
| - mtm (QUIT: Ping timeout: 244 seconds) (~textual@47.202.75.129) | 06:03 | |
| + mtm (~textual@47.202.75.129) | 06:06 | |
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| + talos (~talos@syn-068-186-150-133.res.spectrum.com) | 06:57 | |
| + xandyv (xandyv@user/xandyv) | 09:04 | |
| + chomwitt (~chomwitt@2a02:587:7a13:5400:1ac0:4dff:fedb:a3f1) | 09:12 | |
| - chomwitt (QUIT: Ping timeout: 276 seconds) (~chomwitt@2a02:587:7a13:5400:1ac0:4dff:fedb:a3f1) | 09:32 | |
| + chomwitt (~chomwitt@2a02:587:7a13:5400:1ac0:4dff:fedb:a3f1) | 09:43 | |
| + mjw (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org) | 09:50 | |
| - jacobk (QUIT: Ping timeout: 276 seconds) (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 10:04 | |
| + jacobk (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 10:05 | |
| - mlarkin (QUIT: Read error: Connection reset by peer) (~mlarkin@47.158.172.62) | 10:12 | |
| + mlarkin (~mlarkin@47.158.172.62) | 10:17 | |
| - xandyv (QUIT: Ping timeout: 252 seconds) (xandyv@user/xandyv) | 11:30 | |
| grimmware | josch: would be pretty cool to see a comparison on the same workload | 11:48 |
| + paperManu (~paperManu@107.159.71.33) | 11:49 | |
| josch | grimmware: exactly -- i'd be very interesting to see what unthrottled rk3588 can do :) | 11:50 |
| josch | once i have rk3588 over here i might just do some tests with an active fan :) | 11:51 |
| josch | i also want to do a comparison of battery runtime of imx8mq, a311d and rk3588 with the same battery cells and the same workload | 11:51 |
| josch | (probably just this fullscreen youtube fireplace video that jeff geerling used) | 11:52 |
| BoostisBetter | josch, I know I am very interested in that as well. I would be very interested in your results. | 12:21 |
| josch | BoostisBetter: it's on my todo list :) | 12:22 |
| josch | minute: I tested the latest system image from the reform-system-image gitlab CI pipeline on BoostisBetter's imx8mq classic reform and I got this: https://mister-muffin.de/p/jN3z.png | 12:38 |
| josch | So there is no "M" but the MNT logo gets displayed properly and clicking on the help entry in the menu shows the help. | 12:38 |
| josch | I have staged the <span font=... changes in /etc/skel/.config/waybar/config in reform-system-image but I seem to be unable to reproduce the problem with the stock image :/ | 12:39 |
| * mjw -> Guest3358 | 12:54 | |
| - Guest3358 (QUIT: Killed (osmium.libera.chat (Nickname regained by services))) (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org) | 12:54 | |
| * Guest1096 -> mjw | 12:54 | |
| - laumann (QUIT: Changing host) (~quassel@2a0a-e5c0-2-2-0-c8ff-fe68-bef1.loves.ipv6.at.ungleich.ch) | 12:56 | |
| + laumann (~quassel@user/laumann) | 12:56 | |
| minute | josch: thank you! i'll dig deeper then | 13:02 |
| + gustav28 (~gustav@c-78-82-53-220.bbcust.telenor.se) | 13:02 | |
| minute | currently wondering about the price and material quality of desktop reform (case for classic reform mb) | 13:03 |
| josch | what are the options/prices? | 13:07 |
| josch | minute: maybe the problem is sway/wayfire specific? I only tested with sway | 13:09 |
| hramrach | maybe Framework mainboard case is a reasonable reference | 13:48 |
| minute | josch: aha, she is using wayfire | 13:51 |
| josch | aha, let me try again | 13:52 |
| hramrach | might be nice if it was possible to reuse the reform notebook side panels in desktop to reduce inventory | 13:52 |
| minute | hramrach: thanks for reminding me of that. i see they also have vesa mounts | 13:52 |
| minute | hramrach: yeah that's not possible | 13:52 |
| minute | hramrach: i'll show you in a few minutes the state of things | 13:52 |
| minute | the desktop reform side panels are pcbs | 13:54 |
| hramrach | yes, my general idea would be to put metal plate on top, acrylic plate on bottom, and something in between to not squish the mainboard but with mechanical design there are too many details that can go wrong, and setting them right makes it more complex | 13:56 |
| hramrach | like how thick would have the panels have to be to not bend at this size :/ | 13:58 |
| minute | hramrach: check this out https://mastodon.social/@mntmn/114194887529159077 | 14:03 |
| josch | the usb-c in the rectangular barrel jack cut-out looks odd :D | 14:05 |
| josch | but i appreciate the compatibility with motherboards before 3.0 a lot | 14:05 |
| minute | josch: yes there will be another version with usb-c specific cutout | 14:05 |
| minute | josch: i just started with this one first because for testing it fits both mbs | 14:06 |
| minute | hramrach: interesting, the framework motherboard case is out of stock. | 14:07 |
| josch | problem does also not show with wayfire: https://mister-muffin.de/p/4pMO.png | 14:08 |
| josch | minute: my comment was just a side-remark -- i would've found it very odd if the "hole" was something that would've gone into a final MNT product, considering the quality of the existing product line :) | 14:09 |
| minute | josch: ah, got it :D | 14:09 |
| minute | josch: (and you're right) | 14:09 |
| minute | josch: thanks for checking about the logo. i asked if i can get remote access to the device later to check how that happened | 14:10 |
| hramrach | yes, framework also has inconsistent supply problems | 14:14 |
| hramrach | however, the valueable part is seeing how it is designed, and what users complain about | 14:14 |
| hramrach | my impression is that for the NMT case it would be worthwhile from looks point of view to have laser-cut bottom as oppesed to printed but it makes it less solid mechanically | 14:16 |
| hramrach | also VESA mount is probably harder to do on plain flat panel | 14:17 |
| minute | hramrach: yeah. you've seen my proto in the video? | 14:17 |
| minute | i'll look into other printing options now. it shall not be this kind of fingerprinty mirror surface there | 14:17 |
| hramrach | yes, the large printed flat area does not look great | 14:17 |
| minute | yeah that's just because it's a prototype print here. | 14:18 |
| hramrach | I do not know a printing technology that does this well and effectively | 14:19 |
| hramrach | eg. I am very satisfied with SLS results but the effictivity is bad for parts this large | 14:20 |
| minute | how about MJF or SLA | 14:24 |
| minute | we printed the camera cases with MJF nylon. but not sure how expensive it gets for this size | 14:25 |
| hramrach | no experience with that | 14:25 |
| minute | also, industrial FDM could work and maybe they can do a matte/rough printing surface | 14:25 |
| hramrach | also the nylon is way too flexible | 14:25 |
| hramrach | I suppose they could sand or blast it after printing it to get more uniform surface | 14:26 |
| hramrach | which is probably the default for SLS, and the reason the surface is so uniform | 14:28 |
| hramrach | but my impression is that even using commercial services printing stuff this large is kind of meh - they have some pricing that is based primarily on material used but also to some extent volume occupied, and that will get expensive. | 14:32 |
| - wickedshell (QUIT: Ping timeout: 260 seconds) (~wickedshe@2601:8c0:800:4baa:a85:dd76:3536:c21c) | 14:59 | |
| hramrach | ypu have holes that are potentially threaded close to the edges so it shounds feasible to have actual bottom plate that is cut, and some inserts between plates that go along the long sides only that have all the threaded holes | 15:00 |
| jfred | Matte printing surface leads to a quite nice top layer in my experience | 15:48 |
| jfred | I forget what exactly we have at my local hackerspace but it's a rough textured metal buildplate | 15:49 |
| jfred | for the desktop case I definitely think having something with cheaper materials is good, since part of the purpose IMO is to make reusing older motherboards economical. if the design is flexible enough to also be able to be milled from aluminum that would be great (if e.g. you wanted to build one as your desktop), but less important IMO | 15:52 |
| jfred | if it's buildable in both cheaper and more expensive materials it doesn't have to be you making the more expensive one too, could be a community group-buy thing in the future :) | 15:53 |
| + mark_ (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org) | 15:54 | |
| + wielaard (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org) | 16:02 | |
| - mark_ (QUIT: Ping timeout: 260 seconds) (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org) | 16:04 | |
| minute | jfred: true | 16:20 |
| + wickedshell (~wickedshe@2601:8c0:800:4baa:7d17:d32d:96fe:ea0b) | 16:25 | |
| minute | josch: i'm logged into the pocket with the M, and it doesn't know the package reform-branding somehow | 16:43 |
| minute | interesting > Notice: Can't select versions from package 'reform-branding' as it is purely virtual | 16:44 |
| [tj] | I have a ups notification for a new charger board, how careful should I be with this one? | 16:44 |
| minute | josch: how is this possible? > State: not a real package (virtual) | 16:45 |
| gordon1 | >https://mastodon.social/@mntmn/114194887529159077 | 16:47 |
| gordon1 | minute: vesa mount :3 | 16:47 |
| [tj] | minute: I would like bright orange powder coating like the teenage engineering computer-1 https://teenage.engineering/products/computer-1 | 16:48 |
| minute | josch: it's probably because non-free is not in the sources? | 16:51 |
| minute | pocket-reform-handbook is also not installed | 16:52 |
| minute | oh that system is kind of a mix of an old install and new | 16:53 |
| minute | josch: ok problem solved. she thought that completing the setup wizard would install to emmc at the end automatically, so was then using an old system after removing the microsd | 17:00 |
| minute | josch: plomlompom: that's why we need to integrate the actual reform-setup-encrypted-disk in the setup gui at the end :D | 17:00 |
| grimmware | josch: I have a small fan (somewhere) and a 3D printer so I might have a go at an active cooling hack at some point just for funsies | 17:18 |
| - hairu (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (m-uotkmd@user/hairu) | 17:43 | |
| + hairu (m-uotkmd@user/hairu) | 17:45 | |
| BoostisBetter | Has anyone made a pocket reform top cover on printables or thingaverse? I wanted to print one out just to see how it affects wifi signal strength. | 17:52 |
| BoostisBetter | Nevermind forgot about the heatsink need. | 17:53 |
| minute | BoostisBetter: check the forum, pff has done it, melted instantly | 17:59 |
| BoostisBetter | minute: that makes sense. | 18:02 |
| minute | ok i need to know how to tell a customer how to use reform-setup-encrypted-disk to install to emmc (not ssd) | 18:02 |
| BoostisBetter | minute: isn't it just sudo reform-setup-encrypted-disk emmc or something like that? | 18:04 |
| minute | BoostisBetter: i don't know, the --help doesn't tell | 18:04 |
| minute | it says > [DEVICE_PATH] If provided, path to disk device | 18:04 |
| minute | but people don't know what that means | 18:04 |
| - mtm (QUIT: Ping timeout: 252 seconds) (~textual@47.202.75.129) | 18:05 | |
| BoostisBetter | ok so Grok says: | 18:06 |
| BoostisBetter | first - lsblk | 18:06 |
| BoostisBetter | to get the device id | 18:06 |
| BoostisBetter | second - umount /dev/mmcblk0p* | 18:06 |
| + mtm (~textual@47-202-75-129.fdr01.sprg.fl.ip.frontiernet.net) | 18:06 | |
| josch | minute: i'm glad you found out what was going on but it is not still a problem because there is an upgrade path of an old install to the current one that *removes* reform-branding? I'd suspect that the problem is that if you come from an old install, there is nothing that enables the non-free repository? | 18:06 |
| BoostisBetter | third - reform-setup-encrypted-disk /dev/mmcblk0 | 18:06 |
| minute | josch: correct, that is the problem. but now we're stuck understanding the reform tools | 18:07 |
| josch | minute: it would also be very useful to have the output of reform-check on that system | 18:07 |
| minute | somehow reform-migrate and reform-setup-encrypted-disk seem to be made for targeting ssd only | 18:07 |
| josch | minute: because with reform-check from latest reform-tools (1.69) it should tell you about that thing | 18:08 |
| BoostisBetter | Grok does surprise me sometimes. I know there are some particulars there that are not correct, and some thing specific to the Pocket Reform that might not be accounted for, but it is close enough that figuring out what is missing is usually not too tough. | 18:08 |
| minute | or at least, there's no way how a regular user can figure out how to install to emmc from them | 18:08 |
| josch | minute: but you probably ran that and it didn't output anything useful that hinted at the problem? | 18:08 |
| josch | (which would then be a bug i'd like to fix) | 18:08 |
| minute | josch: sorry, didn't think to run reform-check m)) | 18:09 |
| josch | minute: the ability of reform-setup-encrypted-disk to install to emmc was only added in the last release, so there might very well still be bugs -- you know where to send them :) | 18:09 |
| minute | josch: ok :D but what would i specify as the target... for example /dev/mmcblk2 or /dev/mmcblk2p2? | 18:10 |
| josch | the raw disk, not the partition | 18:10 |
| minute | ok | 18:10 |
| josch | i should probably put something in there that warns if it's a partition and not the disk itself | 18:10 |
| minute | josch: also, an example in the --help for installing to emmc would be nice. or a shortcut for that (because the tool knows where the emmc is on that module) | 18:11 |
| josch | minute: good point! That would mirror tools like reform-boot-config which already has the shorthands sd, ssd, usb, emmc | 18:13 |
| minute | josch: yess | 18:13 |
| - jacobk (QUIT: Ping timeout: 248 seconds) (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 18:19 | |
| + jacobk (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 18:20 | |
| - laumann (QUIT: Read error: Connection reset by peer) (~quassel@user/laumann) | 18:20 | |
| josch | minute: if you can still obtain reform-check output from the upgraded system that might be useful -- maybe there are other things in the output that either would be nice to fix or where the existing text is hard to understand or not very helpful | 18:23 |
| josch | i'll add the shorthands -- i guess i didn't think about that yet because the tool used to be for ssd exclusively :D | 18:23 |
| minute | josch: sorry, not possible as it is being wiped atm | 18:23 |
| josch | ah okay, never mind then :) | 18:24 |
| minute | josch: oh yeah, sorry for seeming impatient about this. i guess it's just one missing puzzle piece--so far we've mostly done the "fresh install to emmc" stuff here with custom scripts, and haven't really thought about how customers will do it easily | 18:24 |
| + laumann (~quassel@2a0a-e5c0-2-2-0-c8ff-fe68-bef1.loves.ipv6.at.ungleich.ch) | 18:25 | |
| josch | oh speaking about that... | 18:27 |
| minute | josch: customer happily reports that "reform-setup-encrypted-disk /dev/mmcblk2" worked out | 18:29 |
| josch | uuuuh sweet! | 18:29 |
| minute | yeah i never heard about booting from encrypted emmc yet | 18:30 |
| josch | minute: so re "custom scripts" above, what you wrote here https://community.mnt.re/t/deleted-the-emmc-partition/2100/2 should have all been integrated into reform-flash-rescue | 18:31 |
| minute | josch: ahhh ok that would have been another approach! i really have severe memory issues about these tools | 18:34 |
| josch | minute: the idea to use reform-setup-encrypted-nvme on eMMC was from ChiefGyk3D on the forum: https://community.mnt.re/t/reinstall-fresh-os-on-emmc/3114 | 18:36 |
| josch | minute: same here -- i'm a mega frequent user of git-log because i forget everything XD | 18:37 |
| josch | and then i get frustrated because i forgot to write all the details in the commit message | 18:37 |
| josch | story of my life | 18:37 |
| josch | for example, i should've added a Thanks: line to that commit 3637865f7dd19294061b0bfd197bf39705dd64ba and linked that forum thread... | 18:38 |
| BoostisBetter | is there a document that talks about keyboard shortcuts and binding? LIke play, stop, volume control, etc? | 18:38 |
| minute | BoostisBetter: yes | 18:38 |
| minute | BoostisBetter: "list of shortcuts" doc here https://mntre.com/docs-pocket-reform.html and also quickstart | 18:39 |
| BoostisBetter | vielen Dank! | 18:39 |
| minute | josch: haha ok then i'm not alone | 18:39 |
| minute | soon i'll have to write some updated docs about various install and update tasks | 18:39 |
| josch | yes, second source of infos is grepping the results of "wget -nc -r --no-parent https://mntre.com/reform-irc-logs/" XD | 18:39 |
| minute | lol | 18:40 |
| BoostisBetter | minute: so no volume controls? Just making sure. | 18:40 |
| josch | oh a while ago, the topic came up that the irc logs store user's IP addresses and make them public even though they are not useful for anybody -- maybe that data should be cleaned | 18:41 |
| josch | i have sent a patch to upstream enabling this functionality: https://github.com/mgedmin/irclog2html/pull/38 | 18:42 |
| josch | it getting merged is waiting for me to also supply test cases | 18:42 |
| minute | BoostisBetter: afaik not (yet) because there's no f11/f12 | 18:44 |
| - mtm (QUIT: Read error: Connection reset by peer) (~textual@47-202-75-129.fdr01.sprg.fl.ip.frontiernet.net) | 18:51 | |
| - chomwitt (QUIT: Ping timeout: 268 seconds) (~chomwitt@2a02:587:7a13:5400:1ac0:4dff:fedb:a3f1) | 19:25 | |
| BoostisBetter | minute: no worries. I love the Pocket. Thanks for making a UMPC. SO far this is the ultimate UMPC. That's something to be proud of. | 19:36 |
| minute | BoostisBetter: thank you, i like to hear it! | 19:40 |
| BoostisBetter | minute: do you feel like Next development is on schedule? | 19:43 |
| - Gooberpatrol66 (QUIT: Quit: Konversation terminated!) (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 19:44 | |
| + Gooberpatrol66 (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 19:45 | |
| minute | BoostisBetter: i think so | 19:47 |
| minute | BoostisBetter: we still didn't get the money though | 19:48 |
| minute | so it's a bit rough austerity times here | 19:48 |
| BoostisBetter | gotcha. Hope it comes soon | 19:50 |
| + xandyv (xandyv@user/xandyv) | 20:06 | |
| + Gooberpatrol_66 (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 20:18 | |
| - Gooberpatrol66 (QUIT: Ping timeout: 260 seconds) (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 20:19 | |
| - mjw (QUIT: Killed (tantalum.libera.chat (Nickname regained by services))) (~mjw@2001:1c06:2486:a800:7602:5eff:dc71:a72c) | 20:34 | |
| * wielaard -> mjw | 20:34 | |
| + Guest805 (~mjw@2001:1c06:2486:a800:7602:5eff:dc71:a72c) | 20:35 | |
| jfred | I'll add on to the Pocket love :) it's my favorite laptop these days. A worthy successor to the Librettos of yore | 21:35 |
| jfred | (and it's so *pretty*) | 21:35 |
| jfred | I think the first laptop I ever used regularly was my dad's Libretto and I've loved tiny laptops ever since | 21:37 |
| + L29Ah (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) | 21:44 | |
| - gustav28 (QUIT: Quit: Quit) (~gustav@c-78-82-53-220.bbcust.telenor.se) | 22:15 | |
| BoostisBetter | heck yeah! The Libretto was amazing! | 22:21 |
| BoostisBetter | The HP Omnibooks were kind in the same vein. Very cool stuff. | 22:21 |
| - jacobk (QUIT: Ping timeout: 276 seconds) (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 22:22 | |
| + jacobk (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 22:22 | |
| grimmware | I also love the shit out of this laptop | 22:31 |
| grimmware | It's like the laptops in hackers but good hahah | 22:32 |
| grimmware | Oh yeah I meant to share before, gl0b and I built some totem split keyboards the other day and I bought this little U shaped USB-C thingy from AliExpress to attach the dongle to the back of my pocket https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/utnBMfdO/1742506527.JPG | 22:35 |
| grimmware | Sorry that’s a bad photo everything I own is black and I live in the dark. | 22:36 |
| - jacobk (QUIT: Ping timeout: 248 seconds) (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 22:46 | |
| + jacobk (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 22:46 | |
| - aperezdc (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (~aperezdc@46.23.89.43) | 22:52 | |
| + aperezdc (~aperezdc@46.23.89.43) | 22:53 | |
| - xandyv (QUIT: Ping timeout: 265 seconds) (xandyv@user/xandyv) | 23:59 | |
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